tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post2085673275132943389..comments2024-03-04T22:54:13.447+05:30Comments on Remains of the Day: Dowry and Alimony, two sides of the same coinUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-45094200035693424462017-08-18T06:24:42.600+05:302017-08-18T06:24:42.600+05:30@anonymous. thanks for pointing out. deleted. m...@anonymous. thanks for pointing out. deleted. must have bulk approved by mistake.Harmanjit Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14714797381673153973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-1269297603517032492017-08-18T06:20:11.750+05:302017-08-18T06:20:11.750+05:30How did you approve of the Jaipur institute commen...How did you approve of the Jaipur institute comment above?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-3897226765228659312017-06-22T14:09:40.209+05:302017-06-22T14:09:40.209+05:30This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.payal jhanwarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05302667241641661843noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-47678763620064953812012-05-09T01:03:03.712+05:302012-05-09T01:03:03.712+05:30for me its tit for tat..but of-course not with sam...for me its tit for tat..but of-course not with same party. Dowry is illegal but socially acceptable while Alimony is legal but personally non-acceptable..:)<br /><br />Alimony should be given in case of only if partner was cheated or been suffered not vice versa(definition needs to be defined for suffering)or not capable to earn or could earn but scarified her career because spouse asked so,<br /><br />or, if kids are there to look after.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-62613670338455653492010-08-12T06:59:25.431+05:302010-08-12T06:59:25.431+05:30@anonymous actualists:
You just don't give up...@anonymous actualists:<br /><br />You just don't give up anonymously propagating your philosophy, do you now? Grrr.Harmanjit Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14714797381673153973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-69550937325734547492010-08-12T04:56:45.003+05:302010-08-12T04:56:45.003+05:30"So what is the way out of this hate between ..."So what is the way out of this hate between man and woman in a democracy?"<br /><br />the way out of human malice is to look deeper. its at the root of all human conflict, then delete the useless hero. it fouls everything we do not just politics.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-40863543100276681702010-08-12T04:16:05.402+05:302010-08-12T04:16:05.402+05:30Anonymous said...
"So what is the way ou...Anonymous said...<br /><br /> "So what is the way out of this hate"<br /><br />become a sensible apperceptive flesh and blood human being *only* and 'actually care' instead of just 'feeling it', as tho *your feelings* are heroic bestowals of beautiful and orderly offerings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-61400698342749880332010-08-11T20:16:51.225+05:302010-08-11T20:16:51.225+05:30So what is the way out of this hate between man an...So what is the way out of this hate between man and woman in a democracy? Marry and get divorced and kids go crazy shooting in the schools? Or stay single and not have kids at all? Democracy seems to be doomed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-26768770199478724302010-07-31T20:28:19.151+05:302010-07-31T20:28:19.151+05:30Harmanjit Singh said...
Such women cannot have it ...Harmanjit Singh said...<br />Such women cannot have it both ways. They cannot condemn men, and in the same breath, demand their help. It is one of the bitterest pills for a husband to swallow when he is ordered to pay his hard-earned money to nourish and support a selfish and greedy wife who has nothing but hate and venom for him. If such women had any self-respect left, they would support themselves with the fruits of their own labour, and not become vengeful parasites."<br /><br /><br />Such men cannot have it both ways. They cannot condemn women, and in the same breath, demand her help. It is one of the bitterest pills for a wife to swallow when she is ordered to give up her ability to earn her own living to nourish and support a selfish and greedy husband who has nothing but hate and venom for her. If such men had any self-respect left, they would let her earn an equal wage for the fruits of her labour, and not become a vengeful parasite.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-50290972622973489312010-07-30T21:13:09.733+05:302010-07-30T21:13:09.733+05:30I see a much larger percentage of men misusing the...I see a much larger percentage of men misusing their position of undue power in the Indian society as opposed to women misusing the laws in their favour (ratio 999:1 if not more). Neither of them are justified but sadly women get a much stronger, rather vicious, opposition merely because the opposite sex still enjoys a more favorable and powerful position in our society and are able to use it in an attempt to 'put her back into her place'. I don't see such vicious attacks against the inherently corrupt men and the social norms that support his corruption. <br /><br />It is also very sad to see the modern educated Indian woman forced to compromise her identity and suffer everyday because of these cruel age-old social rules and expectations of her that in no way can be satisfied by any ordinary mortal in todays world. These only end up reducing the person who is to a nothing - tiring her out and beating out any signs of individualism in her. There is no way she is allowed to be her own person unless she has a father or husband to categorically support her and in this case too the male person offering support may be castigated at some point.<br /><br />Apart from very few spiritually advanced persons I have yet to find someone who considers women as "normal people" in their own right as opposed to someone born to play a supporting role to the normal people (i.e. men) or as objects of entertainment.<br /><br />My thought is that I do not feel the need to debate upon the misuse of such laws by a very low minority of women as much as I do to support the empowerment of female persons/citizens in our society whose number is by far much much greater, the number of the former being negligible in comparison. The only reason such topics are expressed in a volatile manner is because it is a very new phenomenon for our society to see women benefit by a power given to them for a perfectly legitimate reason. Most men are not able to adjust to the notion of women having an equal status, let alone an upper hand or power over anything at all and we see them raving and ranting in public forums.Ruchihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01421195320602898024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-9919022402356729522010-07-24T10:50:46.588+05:302010-07-24T10:50:46.588+05:30LOL @ anonymous who said: "when in Rome, add ...LOL @ <b>anonymous</b> who said: <i>"when in Rome, add fuel to the fire..."</i><br /><br />Isn't it easy to see, it's quite entertaining to be in Rome? ;)<br /><br />Again, a note on irony that lack of free will (if it truly is lacking) leads to:<br /><br />Even if Harmanjit is aware of the underlying human condition that leads people to behave thus, it is his *condition* that leads him to react on an emotional or alternatively rational plane to these injustices by educated woman.<br /><br />If following that you cite lack of free will, Harmanjit might acknowledge your point, or reject it as irrelevant to the present discussion (he 'chose' the latter). But doing either of two would again be pre-determined by the states within his brain.<br /><br />But most ironically, that you point out Harmanjit could better focus on human condition that's caused all this, is also a case of lack of free will. You were pre-programmed to point all this out the way you did (and even the way I am doing).<br /><br />So, while in Rome, it's important to have fun. One can have fun by doing what the Romans do, by adding fuel to the fire, trying extinguish it, or as one ingenious blogger had said - <i>by doing the Romans!</i><br /><br />Because, after dying everything ends there, whether you be in Rome, or outside of it.<br /><br />Apologies for my totall off-topic comment!Ketanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02622410643454108685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-68379365007073942562010-07-17T23:10:12.140+05:302010-07-17T23:10:12.140+05:30this article was hilarious as well as the comments...this article was hilarious as well as the comments:-)itsmenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-45636976160072852372010-07-13T19:50:22.812+05:302010-07-13T19:50:22.812+05:30"But it is a meaningless utopia."
i don..."But it is a meaningless utopia."<br /><br />i don't think you can give it up harman. you've had a taste of that utopia and its better than any drug.<br /><br />and i don't think your really believe the end of suffering is an ideal either. and too much concern about the "larger scale" keeps you conceptualizing. <br /><br />i think its closer than we think. i don't think the emotions delete but become like an obsolete organ that then atrophies. i have the sense that one must climb into another area of the mind that sees the senselessness in emotional reactions. <br /><br />i compare whats happening to me as like learning to drive a manual car. i'm in the senses most of the time now that parts easy, and watching the mind moving in and out of day dreams and stopping it but i keep forgetting to become aware of apperception when the coast is clear. i know something will click into gear when i finally coordinate these two and then the car will glide along smoothly. i'm still jerking it down the road at the moment, because i never concentrate enough. <br />i think a meditation background would have been a great help.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-37267388847736413552010-07-13T18:37:32.167+05:302010-07-13T18:37:32.167+05:30From the above anonymous comments, I see AF fundam...From the above anonymous comments, I see AF fundamentalism on the rise.<br /><br />To be on the safe side, I'm going to post my comment as anonymous as well!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-8419472805762396852010-07-13T17:47:24.940+05:302010-07-13T17:47:24.940+05:30@anonymous:
Harman, it is clear you wrote a piece...@anonymous:<br /><br /><i>Harman, it is clear you wrote a piece that was based on faulty logic and each of your defenses has been proved wrong beyond doubt. you are obviously having a difficult time accepting that. You look even more foolish with your replies.</i><br /><br />If you have nothing of substance to say except use epithets and adjectives ("faulty logic", "having a difficult time", "foolish", "proved beyond doubt") then in future, instead of "daring" me to publish your enlightening commentary, allow me the freedom to moderate it as I see fit.Harmanjit Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14714797381673153973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-20249379577608919292010-07-13T17:19:43.315+05:302010-07-13T17:19:43.315+05:30"only incremental changes in our use of viole..."only incremental changes in our use of violence and force"??????<br />Harman, it is clear you wrote a piece that was based on faulty logic and each of your defenses has been proved wrong beyond doubt. you are obviously having a difficult time accepting that. You look even more foolish with your replies.<br />I dare you to post this comment.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-70324251064066374732010-07-13T14:43:49.461+05:302010-07-13T14:43:49.461+05:30why are you raging against the injustices of the u...<i>why are you raging against the injustices of the uneducated masses. you now hold a deeper knowledge of the root cause of their predicaments, it serves you nor them one jot to withhold it </i><br /><br />It is impossible (or at least impossibly impractical) to even attempt to take out the "root cause" (the socio-biological conditioning) at the large scale. Then laws are actually not needed. But it is a meaningless utopia.<br /><br />It is far better/useful/practical to educate and modulate. I am no longer an idealist who seeks an end of suffering etc., only incremental changes in our use of violence and force. For example, in this particular case, I am writing about the perils of affirmative action for women.Harmanjit Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14714797381673153973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-13378269779883957242010-07-13T14:26:46.016+05:302010-07-13T14:26:46.016+05:30Harman: "I am talking about the misuse of tho...Harman: "I am talking about the misuse of those laws by normal human beings."<br /><br />:-) well, don't they match? normal twisted laws for normal devious human beings to misuse as they normally do? <br /><br />Harman: "Talking about their "conditioning" as a factor is as useful as talking about sexuality, or the energy from the sun, being the root cause of it all."<br /><br />so whats your point then, whats constructive about griping about the griping masses.<br /><br />why are you raging against the injustices of the uneducated masses. you now hold a deeper knowledge of the root cause of their predicaments, it serves you nor them one jot to withhold it <br /><br />its like you have digressed to when in Rome, add fuel to the fire... <br /><br />you were once as unaware as them too remember, and if it weren't for the few who dared to speak out, you would never have glimpsed as much as you did about the human condition and its potential for commonsense and joy. you'd still be one of them. so why are you writing as tho you are and have returned to the herd.<br /><br />whats happened to you man? <br /><br />speak if it helps, we are here for you too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-5549870181575892242010-07-13T08:40:24.177+05:302010-07-13T08:40:24.177+05:30@anonymous: Do you still think there is nothing wr...@anonymous: <i>Do you still think there is nothing wrong with the patrilocal system?</i><br /><br />Every system (be it nuclear, patrilocal, matrilocal, single parenting) has its upsides and downsides. But in the context of this article, for urbane couples, it is usually a nuclear family. I don't think the wife sacrifices anything at all by moving in with him.<br /><br />@anonymous:<br /><br /><i>do you truly no longer see the cultural backlog of programming and instinctual passions controlling these people?</i><br /><br />I once heard of a spiritual teacher who was asked by a poor woman on how to better educate her kids now that they were becoming very precocious. His answer was, and I quote, "The whole world is suffering. There is no lasting solution but to abide in the Brahma."<br /><br />The laws are there to modulate the behavior of normal human beings. I am talking about the misuse of those laws by normal human beings. Talking about their "conditioning" as a factor is as useful as talking about sexuality, or the energy from the sun, being the root cause of it all.<br /><br />@anonymous:<br /><br /><i>which is even genetically wrong because boys inherit just one X chromosome from their moms and the X has far more genetic material than the puny Y chromosome they inherit from their dads!, girls on the other hand inherit one X from mom and one from dad</i><br /><br />There is no other way to say it, but wherever you are getting your feminist thought-for-the-day, ain't gonna be at a genetic conference anytime soon.Harmanjit Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14714797381673153973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-18842046868838793202010-07-12T07:06:30.330+05:302010-07-12T07:06:30.330+05:30Anonymous said...
"Today we have no authorit...Anonymous said...<br /><br />"Today we have no authoritarian power to enforce a law abolishing the patriarchal or patriotical systems taken for granted in Indian society and used as an excuse to take the woman for granted in India."<br /><br />doesn't Indian parliament use it's legislative assembly to abolish defunct laws and vote in the new, whilst we are still so dumb as to need others to FORCE us to behave sensibly? <br /><br />even if a motion has to be re-presented for decades, if it is sensible enough and as a nations mindset g-r-a-d-u-a-l-l-y changes there should eventually be a consensus vote for more sensible laws. isn't India's gvt utilizing that democratic option? <br /><br />Oh right, the people keep voting for patriarchal parties. well there you go.... mob rules. a stupid government only reflects the stupidity of the people who voted for it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-30479644905627588752010-07-11T21:43:45.306+05:302010-07-11T21:43:45.306+05:30Anonymous said...
"Men in India will have to...Anonymous said...<br /><br />"Men in India will have to understand once they get married they are doing so to start their own family, not just to continue their fathers or grandfathers family."<br /><br />right on, and further, we are being reminded over here that if we only ever vote (proudly) the way we've always voted or the way our parents (proudly) always voted there's no point in going to the poles. we aren't exercising the whole reason the voting system exists, a chance to change. <br /><br />yes it's truly amazing that we 'can' string two words together, but then maybe not, since we only say the same ol things ......for centuries. <br /><br />the fun thing is that as you begin to snap out of it, everything single thing you see and do is a lesson in futility that you can't scramble out of fast enough. the urgency escalates.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-58113059019582785932010-07-11T18:34:03.152+05:302010-07-11T18:34:03.152+05:30Sati was the custom or culture of the day when it ...Sati was the custom or culture of the day when it took a foreign power like the British to abolish the custom with one law giving Indians no option but to accept the law.<br /><br />Today we have no authoritarian power to enforce a law abolishing the patriachal or patrilocal systems taken for granted in Indian society and used as an excuse to take the woman for granted in India.<br /><br />Even if you cannot get the Govt to enforce such a law surely if educated men like Harman can now see how unfair and invalid this concept is and how it is the root main cause of women being treated badly and behaving badly themselves, then my purpose of writing here would have been served.<br /><br />Men in India will have to understand once they get married they are doing so to start their own family, not just to continue their fathers or grandfathers family. Therefore if they continue to treat a woman as if she is just a tool to continue the lineage of his family and not hers, they will see a backlash from the woman who has been unfairly pushed into this role(which is even genetically wrong because boys inherit just one X chromosome from their moms and the X has far more genetic material than the puny Y chromosome they inherit from their dads!, girls on the other hand inherit one X from mom and one from dad). So whatever way you think about it, a social change has to take place regarding this unfair treatment of a woman which makes her helpless and hit back with brute force when the stress becomes unbearable for her.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-70670699981452327952010-07-11T11:32:37.024+05:302010-07-11T11:32:37.024+05:30but if India uses the same excuse for continuing t...but if India uses the same excuse for continuing this custom as it does for it's cast system, then nothing will change. "this is OUR tradition" they cry! the Japanese use the same nonsense for their whaling. every culture does. these are SACRED tradition, the souls of cultures. i tell you the soul of everything is starting to looking dumber and dumber everyday. <br /><br />in fact it just amazes me sometimes that people can even string two words together so few use anything more than the most shallow parroting portions of the brain. its weird watching all this unused mental potential going to waste. like watching billions of semiconscious ghouls having lively conversations about NOTHING that hasn't been said a billion times before! and if one dares to speak of something brand spanking new, they all go stone deaf. lately human life has started to look quite creepy and i've retreated to leave it to the madding crowds to adoringly adorn an emperor that doesn't exist.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-51354635293205328262010-07-10T17:07:16.759+05:302010-07-10T17:07:16.759+05:30there's a difference between law and individua...there's a difference between law and individual position. as an individual, it is indeed reprehensible for a self sufficient, employed woman to expect alimony. but at an aggregate, social level, women have the traditional role of housemakers. even educated woman have to give up their careers to look after the household. this certainly puts them at a disadvantage. i dont disagree with alimony as a law. once this aggregate position is corrected, the lay can be done away as well.Pankajhttp://pankajunk.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7037385.post-56785032495068640372010-07-10T11:40:55.867+05:302010-07-10T11:40:55.867+05:30Harman wrote:
No self-respecting educated urbane ...Harman wrote:<br /><br />No self-respecting educated urbane woman would want to enter a relationship which involves a demand for dowry in exchange for getting married to a man. But almost all of them not only acquiesce to, but insist upon, alimony when separating from their husbands. Rare is the woman who considers the breakdown of a relationship as a mutual tragedy and does not seek to wreak financial or other vengeance upon her husband."<br /><br />when i read these words i can't help wondering what's happened to your knowledge of the human condition.<br /><br />do you truly no longer see the cultural backlog of programming and instinctual passions controlling these people?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com